Mobiusstriptech
Posts: 163
Joined: 13 Apr 2018, 15:41

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

12 Feb 2019, 21:15

I can share details from the testing I did on the new board revision. This is basically a report from shmups. So if you read my comments there, this is nothing new.

The most important thing, which I think is a question that current owners may have, is this board "better" than the last one? Yes and no. It's better in that it has the add-on boards already installed, but the output results are basically the same. Comparing the previous revision with both the FBX and FU-RGB boards to this new revision, the difference in signal quality is so minor that it can only be seen via machines. It will not be discernible by human eyes or ears. FBX can of course detail his thoughts on this as well.

On the video side the signal output is the same as using the FU-RGB. There is slightly less noise in the signal but that doesn't translate to anything noticeable on screen. The ~$300 question, should you replace your current board with the new one. Nope. If you already have the FU-RGB and FBX amp, you have the same thing for all intents and purposes. If you don't have the add-on boards and don't notice any of the issues, cool. You are all set still, just keep using your device and have fun.

I am not a member of TO. I have no insight into their operations behind the scenes. I do think that some credit should be given to Alex for coming on here and laying everything out on the table. Along with admitting that mistakes were made and they are learning from them. Does that forgive everything that has transpired? No. However, we all have the choice to decide if we want to continue holding onto the past or move forward.

If you hate TO, that's your right. If you love TO, that's your right too. I personally love what the SSDS3 represents/provides me. I am just glad that I will soon be able to maybe sit down and actually play some games on mine. Right after I finish the remaining installs for some of you. I hope everyone that owns one of these currently enjoys it, or gets to enjoy it now. For the people that held out and plan to purchase now, I hope you enjoy it too.

Below are scope plots taken from the original Rev2 SSDS3. Also a plot from the FU-RGB board output. Lastly a plot from the newest revision SSDS3 which has the FU-RGB and FBX circuits on board.

If you don't understand what these show. Look at the amount of fluctuations in the signal. The other part you can look at is the Amplitude value on the bottom of the window. The correct value for RGB signals on 75ohm impedance NTSC signals is going to be ~700mV Peak to Peak.

The important part to take away from these plots is that the newest revision of the SSDS3 produces what is essentially the equivalent signal. The variance between the FU-RGB and latest revision is all well within spec and reasonable in it's fluctuations. These captures were taken using all of the same hardware while displaying a white screen under load using the 240p test suite. The only difference was the SSDS3 unit from the first 2 plots to the last for obvious reasons. The test unit is a bone stock white PC Engine that is the noisiest internally that I own.

Original Red channel
Image

FU-RGB board installed Red channel
Image

Latest revision SSDS3 with built in FU-RGB and FBX circuits
Image
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Mobiusstriptech
Posts: 163
Joined: 13 Apr 2018, 15:41

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

12 Feb 2019, 21:27

cybercylon wrote:
12 Feb 2019, 17:05
On the one hand, I am glad that people will get a fixed product in the future. I guess this product will be board revision 4. That said, there could be third parties that still have stocks of the version 3 (or even 2 I guess) that they are still selling. Not everyone frequents forums, so they may not be aware of the board with the fixes is on the way.

Though I don't seem to have the audio issues, It would be nice to have the RGB video cleaned up. The problem is that I don't have the skills, and who knows if Mobius has the boards anymore. Either way, it voids the warranty on a product that was supposed to have been fixed back in July 2018 (according to Terra Onion's tweets).

While I realize that I am owed nothing, I don't see this as the same as when Krikzz introduces a newer Everdrive with new features. This is what it is... a fix for a feature that is already there.

One question that I do have is how much does a Framemeister or OSSD contribute to the issues? A common response is to blame one of these products, yet based on what people post, the RGB noise can still be seen on a PVM, though to a much lesser extent. If either upscaler was to blame for the audio, I would expect even more complaining. My guess is that cheap unshielded RGB cables seem to contribute more to that issue. I'd like to know a little more about this factor, and if it is a misconception that upscalers contribute to the RGB noise and any audio issues one might experience. Is it fair for a reseller to charge a restocking fee when it is the Super SD System 3 that has the issue?

So I guess we shall see how well these two fixes will work once they are out in the wild. If it resolves the RGB issue even with upscalers, then I can decide to either live with what I have or try to sell the revision 3 unit and pick up the new revision.
I did run out of boards on Monday. I had no plans to restock them. However, I have had multiple people reach out to me asking for them. Some very pleasantly, others not so much. I am looking at doing another batch albeit a smaller one. The downside to this is the price per board would have to increase.

I don't know how many SSDS3 units were sold so I took a guess and had 300 boards made. Obviously that was not enough. I don't know what the price will be, but I am shopping it currently for a smaller run to hopefully meet the needs of the people who are still after the board.

For those not familiar with manufacturing, the size of the batch will heavily dictate the prices of components and assembly costs. Larger batches are cheaper per unit but obviously more expensive in total. If anyone with a rev2/rev3 board is looking for the FU-RGB board, definitely let me know. I am going to try and determine the batch size that will be most economical but also the most likely to sell out of.

cybercylon
Posts: 9
Joined: 02 Dec 2018, 16:39

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

12 Feb 2019, 23:38

Thanks for the two posts.

If I were to get the fix installed, don't worry, I'll ask nicely. :)

keropi
Posts: 33
Joined: 08 May 2018, 21:37

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

14 Feb 2019, 10:01

It would be nice if they at least could offer those addon boards for existing customers with a symbolic/parts-only price or something.
I was lucky to get the RGB board from Mobius - and his price was a steal - I can't see why TO can't do the same and attempt to kinda make it up to their old customers that supported them in the beginning.

Mobiusstriptech
Posts: 163
Joined: 13 Apr 2018, 15:41

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

15 Feb 2019, 02:31

I do have a new batch enroute to me. So they will be available again through me. The new batch is unfortunately more expensive as I did a smaller run since sales were decreasing overall and I don't know how many more unmodified units exist.

mastamuzz
Posts: 19
Joined: 11 Aug 2018, 02:15

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

15 Feb 2019, 05:43

Mobius are you able to sell it to Canada? I'll definitely prefer to get an assembled piece than getting 3 boards and sourcing parts.

On the side of adding the parts well I like TO but I still feel the parts should be sent from TO even with a fair price but at least available through them as easy just to click, pay and receive, I feel this could be part of making up for the mistake cause sourcing the FBX board is not as easy for me, I can't help it, the grainy screen just pisses me off.

Mobiusstriptech
Posts: 163
Joined: 13 Apr 2018, 15:41

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

15 Feb 2019, 06:16

Yes. I have been shipping internationally the entire time they have been for sale. The software I use on my website makes international shipping as easy as within the US so it doesn't matter to me where you are located. The only downside is the cost of shipping. Are you still looking for the FBX board as well or did you get that?

mastamuzz
Posts: 19
Joined: 11 Aug 2018, 02:15

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

15 Feb 2019, 08:17

yeah still looking for the FBX board.

Badtaste
Posts: 1
Joined: 16 Feb 2019, 17:03

Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

16 Feb 2019, 17:06

So, if I buy one right now, will I get the revision with fixes? (If not, I can wait patiently to get the updated revision)

Thank you

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Todd
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Re: New Board Revision with FBX & FU-RGB Fixes?

16 Feb 2019, 17:36

Badtaste wrote:
16 Feb 2019, 17:06
So, if I buy one right now, will I get the revision with fixes? (If not, I can wait patiently to get the updated revision)

Thank you
Yes. The ones currently for sale in our shop are the revised boards with the audio and video fixes.

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